Date of Interview: 7 August 2025
Interviewer: Tiurlan Sitompul
Interviewee: Mei Mac
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
Thursday, 7th of August for New Earth Theatre Living Archive. Interviewee Tiurlan Passmore. And I’m talking with –
MEI MAC
Hi, my name is Mei Mac.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
Thank you Mei Mac. My first question is how did your journey with New Earth Theatre begin?
MEI MAC
New Earth Theatre, or formerly Yellow Earth Theatre, was the beginning of my journey. To be honest, I simply would not be here if it weren’t for New Earth Theatre, if it weren’t for Kumiko Mendl bringing a road trip to Birmingham.
At the time, I think I was 16 years old, and I was intending to pursue a career in medicine, and that was my intention was to go to university and study medicine. And I was meant to be the first person in my family to go to university.
And then Kumiko came with, I think Tina Chiang was part of that group and I can’t remember maybe, I don’t know, David Lee Jones was there too. People who are now my friends, who were part of this road trip and that road trip shows to me, I met working actors of Asian, Southeast Asian heritage, and I’ve always had a love for drama and the arts. I had always done extracurricular as a young person, but I’d never taken it seriously as something I could actually do for a living because I had never seen it. And even if I did dream of it, I always figured it would be way too unstable to actually make a living out of. But Kumiko and the actor that she brought with her to this road trip in Birmingham showed me otherwise.
Honestly, it was amazing. There were these leaflets that showed up at my Chinese school on a Saturday on my desk and it said, “We need you.” And I was like, what? What is this? What is this? What is this leaflet? It’s something to do with drama stuff, with actors. And it was essentially just an advert to like meet working actors, ask some questions, Q and A and I went, and my whole life changed.
Because I was like, God, I’ve never seen this seriously until now. And because Kumiko showed me what was possible, I then started to pursue it. And that’s when I started my time with the New Earth Academy, the two week free training program that happened over the summer, where I met some amazing practitioners and artists and people that inspired me to then pursue this professionally.
After that, I had an intro to the industry, into the art form through the academy, and I just didn’t look back. It was my calling, and so I gave up everything in my life to pursue it. That was the beginning of my journey, and I would not be here if it wasn’t for the New Earth Theatre.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
How did your family take it, now that there is no Dr. Mei Mac?
MEI MAC
Yeah. They did not take it very well. It’s a classic story, isn’t it? And so many of us have this exact same story. So. Yeah, at the beginning, they did not take it well at all. It was a real struggle. Thankfully, my mother and my family have come around. They are now very supportive, but it took a number of years for them to really understand what I was pursuing.
I think from their perspective, I think this will really resonate with a lot of people. For me, I have thrown away everything that my mother, my parents have sacrificed to give me a stable life and for me to seemingly throw that away for a career in the arts was devastating for them and my mother talks about it now.
She was like, well, back then I didn’t know that you would be able to make it to where you are now. We had never, ever seen someone who looked like us in Britain make anything of themselves in this field, and I didn’t want that for you. I didn’t want that life of struggle for you. Let’s be real. It’s still a struggle.
No, it doesn’t stop being a struggle. But due to the campaigning of so many people in this industry and. And I have taken on that mantle myself, I think we’ve really changed what society can imagine us to be. You know, how we imagined ourselves. And I just never imagined that I could do something like this until it was shown to me, until someone had believed in me, which is what Kumiko did for me.
And then eventually, my family came around and have now become very supportive. But it was terrifying for them. Didn’t go to university, didn’t pursue medicine. It was a difficult time, but I’m glad that we sort of reconciled now.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
What was your first impression when you joined the company?
MEI MAC
I think the first sensation was like unbridled excitement. I think I was very inspired by all the artists and the practitioners that I had met.
I was really fueled by the campaign work, the activism work that people in the company had been doing for years and years and years. And it really felt like my honor to be able to contribute to that and to, you know, the thing that I’ve been saying for the past five years is I am aware and grateful for the shoulders that I stand on in order to be here.
And it has always been my aim to make my shoulders broad enough for the next generation to stand upon, which is what Rising Waves is also partly about. For those who don’t know, Rising Waves is the organization that I co-founded with some incredible artists, and we take emerging artists, and we pair them in a mentorship program with established artists and offer things like workshops and support.
And it’s a community effort through the practical act of skill sharing. And I’m really proud of it and everything that we’ve done with it. And I learned to do what I do with Rising Waves from what I’d seen previously through New Earth. It’s a real sense of community. And that, plus what I’d learned from Veronica Needa, who is also one of the co-founders of Yellow Earth Theatre, who is also co-founder of True Heart Theatre.
And she took me under her wing and taught me everything that I know about building community and what it means to look after people. So if it weren’t for them, I wouldn’t be here. And they taught me everything I know.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
And I sort of learned that New Earth influenced or shaped your personal or professional growth. So in what ways do you think that they can do that?
MEI MAC
In all the ways I just described I think. That in my career so far, though, I’ve had real variety, like I’ve had such I’ve been so grateful for the variety of work that I’ve managed to do, lots of which has been like centered around my skill set and the art that I make and hasn’t necessarily always been focused on my heritage or my race. But when it has been focused on my heritage or race, it’s always been in celebration or interrogation or in something that provokes and has always been humanising, which I’m so grateful for because I’ve not, I think lots of people in the industry haven’t had that experience. They’ve had to take work that has been dehumanising to pay the bills or because there’s nothing else out there. And I think that’s a real travesty. So I’ve been very lucky to not have had the experience so far. But the through line throughout my entire career is that of community, and I think that is one of my core values that I learned in my time with New Earth Theatre, with Veronica Needa, with True Heart Theatre. These are the places that taught me that. And so I try to maintain that through line, through everything that I do is a sense of community. Because without the community that I experienced when I first joined the industry, I would have felt totally lost. And I, you know, I’d given up everything – I had left my family, my home, everything that I knew, any kind of stability.
And if it weren’t for that sense of community that I experienced and or the beautiful people that I met, you know, took me under their wing, I wouldn’t have the strength to continue.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
Do you remember a moment when you truly feel part of the New Earth family?
MEI MAC
All the time? All the time. I think that any time the beautiful thing that I love about our community is that any time any of us does a show or puts on something, we all show up for each other and sometimes I describe it like going to a press night of a show, or actually any night of any show where one of us is in. It feels like a big fat Asian wedding, like we all come out to support and we’re all in the bar afterwards, and it feels like I’m at a wedding because it feels like I’m with my family. So I think when we all come together or like when there are events where we’re celebrating like, you know, the New Earth anniversaries or like new Kumiko handing over the reins to Ailin or, you know, Rising Waves and our community events.
Those are the moments that I really, really feel it.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
Can you tell us the production where you were involved in New Earth that was particularly meaningful for you?
MEI MAC
The very first New Earth Academy that I was a part of, the first time that I had done anything of that sort that was that was, you know, outside of my school and extracurricular and had a taste of a small taste of what it would feel like to do this professionally and just meeting lots of like minded people who are passionate about the same thing and had similar goals. That was a bit of a bug and never looked back, so that was obviously like a game changer in my life.
And then my time with New Earth Theatre doing Under the Umbrella was a really special one, because up until that point in my career, I’ve been very lucky to have worked my whole career. But I’d never imagined myself in leading parts, and I had been very comfortable in my career playing ensemble roles, because I’ve got a very unique skill set, which is very specifically helpful for ensemble storytelling.
I love ensemble storytelling. It’s my absolute, it’s such a core part of my practice, and I love it. And I think the ensemble work is just a beautiful act of storytelling. But I’d never imagined I’d become a leading role. Not that I even desire to, maybe, maybe there’s a part of me that feels don’t dare to dream, you know, like this is already way more than you bargained for.
But if you’re not put into those positions, you then don’t learn and you don’t grow. And it was New Earth Theatre that gave me my first ever leading role in Under the Umbrella. And I was much younger, granted and I think I’m a much better performer now than I was then, but the amount of faith that people had in me to lead that show and the amount that I grew as a performer, but also as a human being, that I really started to believe in myself as the author of my own stories was really impactful.
And perhaps that wouldn’t have happened in the mainstream theatres that I was working in. It took the company that I’d started in to bring me back and see me for what I was worth, and gave me the opportunity to try my hand at another role. And so that was incredibly meaningful. And everyone who I worked with in that production are still like dear, dear friends of mine. And they really are like family. And I love and respect all of them. And that was a really pivotal moment in my career where I suddenly thought to myself, wow, I could do even more than I dreamed.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
You talked earlier about storytelling, so how would you describe New Earth’s approach to storytelling and representation?
MEI MAC
I think that storytelling and representation are two very separate things that have very meaningful overlap, and the fact that the company exists and the legacy of the company itself is a story.
It tells the story of a company that has been knocked back so many times for various reasons, and has maintained its determination to support artists to make work, great work, to make sometimes not so great work because we have to make sometimes not so great work to discover where the great work is. And that is powerful as an artist to be given the freedom to experiment.
And that’s what the company has always done. It’s always believed in its artists. Even when you fall flat on your face, making something terrible but then you learn to make great art afterwards.
Kumiko once said to me that sometimes the company felt like a stepping block, in that emerging artists come to the company to create things to get their teeth stuck in, and then from that, they launch off into other places.
As the company has grown, I would describe, I think it’s a disservice in some ways to the company to call it a stepping block. It is more like a pillar that holds up so many of our careers, that holds up so much of our practice and our work as artists. And also it sort of feeds into itself, like the company has become and created its own ecology that maybe once someone described it as a stepping block.
But then there’s artists who make it to further places and learn more things then come back to the company and feed the community, and the work gets more exciting and richer and more diverse. And I find that really beautiful. And that in and of itself is the story of the company.
How it feeds itself and the generosity of all the practitioners that have ever worked at the company, that give and give and give to artists who are both emerging, mid and also at the end of their career, it sort of cycles itself and it’s really beautiful.
And if it weren’t for the dedication of the company, and I think everyone has run it and been a part of it, so many careers like my own wouldn’t have been able to have been, wouldn’t have been able to flourish because that support is so vital. And without that support, the representation doesn’t exist.
Like representation doesn’t exist in a vacuum. It exists because someone believed in you to make something. And in all the years where, you know, fads and fashions in art and theatre have come and gone, they’ve maintained that determination. And it is the consistent support that means that representation can grow and grow and grow.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
What do you think then sets apart New Earth theatre with the other theatre company?
MEI MAC
I think because it feels like family; because there are so many outreach programs all across this industry that result in nothing. It’s almost like paying lip service. New Earth Theatre doesn’t do that. At the end of every outreach program, there is something tangible that has been experienced or achieved, and you know that you can always come back to the company for a conversation, for collaboration, for inspiration.
I think that’s probably what sets it apart. And also that there has been a rolling conversation in the company about what things like authenticity means. I think that that can mean a lot of different things to different people. But with the company being sort of at the heart of open conversation, it feels like a safe place for those difficult conversations to have.
Like, what does authenticity mean when our lived experiences are so different and polarized sometimes? What does it mean to create authentic work? What does it mean to own your own voice and to portray it respectfully with humanity? How do we tackle difficult things in our community? Like what do we do about Miss Saigon? What do we do about the King and I?
What do we do about yellowface in opera? All these really difficult, frustrating, painful conversations that really can only be had when the community feels safe and that feels if someone is listening. I think that’s really special about what the company has done over the years.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
We’ve talked about the visibility of British East and Southeast Asian artists and stories. So why and how has New Earth contributed to this visibility?
MEI MAC
By paying artists? I think sometimes, it can be that simple. Paying artists consistently nurturing artists, consistently hiring artists. Making bold choices, making mistakes, trying new things, experimenting. If it weren’t for the company, most of us wouldn’t be here. And if none of us are here, then there is, then we cannot represent.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
Since you’ve already (spent) some time in the industry, right? So have you witnessed a shift in the industry because of the work of New Earth?
MEI MAC
Yes, absolutely. I think the shift in industry has happened because of numerous things and nothing exists in a vacuum. I think it’s been a real force of many different techniques and tactics coming together. And sort of pushing through that bamboo ceiling, as it were.
And I think that every contribution to that push on that bamboo ceiling is vital and important and necessary, and New Earth has been a major part of that, mostly because it’s a scary thing to go against the status quo, to stick your head above purpose and say, this isn’t right, or things need to change, or how do we make this change?
And there is a thing of safety in numbers, which is what the company has always felt like to me, that if I’m going to stick my head above purpose and ask and demand and try and make change happen, I know that there is a company of artists who will support me. Not blindly, obviously with nuance and with criticism and with, you know, like due process.
But I do know that there is a company of artists and activists who will support what I’m trying to do, or at least help guide me. So I think that is one of the major ways the company has done that.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
So we established that New Earth actually supports all the BESEA artists then?
MEI MAC
Absolutely. I mean, even just to have a company that the community can call one of their various homes is very unique and vital.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
And is there any particular moment during your time with New Earth that you find is difficult? And how did you get the help to navigate?
MEI MAC
There have been several moments that have been difficult. Because when we as a community are talking about difficult things, we are not all the same in our approach and we are not all the same in our opinions. Or our lived experience and that diversity is a beautiful thing, but it will always provide some friction.
And I think learning that we as a community can have difficult conversations and knowing that they’re important so that we come back to do the next difficult conversation is both cathartic, difficult and powerful. And even, you know, the way that Ailin in recent times has been facilitating difficult conversations.
And myself, I have learned over the years to facilitate difficult conversations about provocative topics is the sign of a really active and healthy community.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
So in what ways do you think the company is for all this time in relation to inclusion, access, advocacy?
MEI MAC
Yeah, I think that the company has been growing and learning every year. With each production, I think the company gets more ambitious and rolling out shows in UK’s regions has been really amazing to see.
And the shows touring to places where you wouldn’t necessarily expect audiences to come to. But they do. Yeah, it’s been really beautiful to see and to see the company, even just the academies, which has been life changing for so many of us. Now that they do so many of them all across the country, they have like the Performers Academy, the Plus Academy and the Writer’s Academy now they’ve got Backstage academies. The academies, I could not sing their praises enough.
I said that’s just the most incredible thing and is the reason so many of us are here. And to see the company evolve and to create more of those academies has been just inspiring to witness. And I’m so proud of the company for doing that. I think the shows, even the shows that have been programmed or in development for the next few years, are really exciting.
Like, I can see the evolution of the company, I can see that the work is also like getting more ambitious. It’s getting better and it’s getting more exciting and more challenging. And the outreach is getting better. But it doesn’t feel rushed as well. The company has been through some hard, hard times in every way, especially financially, but never unwavering in its support of East Asians and Southeast Asian artists.
So it feels like the building blocks have been very securely put in place, and the foundations are very securely put before the company, like, continues to grow and reach out.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
You talk very good things about the academy. So suppose that you want to leave a message to someone discovering New Earth for the first time, what would you say?
MEI MAC
I would say you belong here. I would say don’t be afraid to let it get messy in your exploration. Don’t be afraid to make mistakes. This will be a lifelong friendship and evolution, and I truly believe that the company will be here for the rest of our careers, and it will continue to evolve. Treat it like family.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
And now, what does it mean for you to be part of the New Earth’s 30 year legacy?
MEI MAC
Oh. Oh man, I actually feel very emotional.
Because the company means so much to me, and any opportunity that I get to pay homage to my roots, which is the company, I do. Because I could never express my gratitude enough. Otherwise I would be having an exhausting, difficult, miserable time, probably in a hospital somewhere. And maybe my soul would be, I don’t know, much less enriched.
I’m honored. Honoured to have been able to give back to the company as much as it gave me, honoured to to continue to support it, grow, to sing its praises, to be part of the challenging discussions, to challenge the company itself when need be. I’m honoured and feel so grateful.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
What are your hopes for the next generation of BESEA artists for the New Earth in the future?
Thinking like some families still want a doctor, a PhD or an economist. So how do you advise or give a message of hope to the new artist?
MEI MAC
I do think that the world has changed a lot, and there are now a lot more role models than it used to be. For anyone who wants to make art their livelihood, there is so much more support than there ever used to be.
And I remember even when I first started in 2011, yes, 2011, that I felt really alone and really scared, and the company showed me that I wasn’t alone. And I could teach myself to not be afraid. So the message is to find your tribe, to find your people, to find your collaborators who inspire you and support you and uplift you.
I really believe that the only way we all succeed in this world is by championing each other. That’s largely the ethos of Rising Waves as well, is to champion each other and to support each other. Then I suppose the most important thing for me and for all people of East and Southeast Asian heritage, or anyone who is marginalised in this country, is to develop your voice as a person.
Your political beliefs, your practice, and how you want to move through the world based on these things and to have confidence in your voice. I think that is the most important thing about representation. Is that we cannot rely upon other people to give us what we think we deserve. We have to work out how to do that for ourselves.
And also there in that, I think you become a much better artist when you learn to do things on your own terms. For yourself, or for your intended audience, or for your people, community, whatever. It’s important that you nurture your voice, you nurture your ideas and your ideals, and learn how to communicate that to the world and put it out there. I think that is what representation really is, is getting your voice out there.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
If you have something else that you want to say, is there anything that you want to add?
MEI MAC
I think the last thing that I would like to add, which is something that I try to do and I hope that the next generations do the same, is to remember the shoulders that you stand on. And when you can, send the elevator back down.
I think that is also how we develop as a community, is to remember our history and to pay homage to those who did come before us, because none of us walk alone, and most of us are walking in footprints that have walked before us, or building upon those footprints. And that’s why I think this oral history project is also so gorgeous, because it’s one way in which we pay homage to those who paved the way before us and built the path before us.
And it’s really beautiful to look back and to thank them.
TIURLAN SITOMPUL
Thank you. As part of New Earth’s 30th anniversary, do you want to wish them in your own words?
MEI MAC
Of course. Happy 30th anniversary, New Earth Theatre. I would not be here without you, and I am so grateful every day for the work that you do. We are all so grateful. Long may it continue to the next 30 years.